Was Mapleshade really evil?

[Tess_Potter]

I don't think that Mapleshade was evil at all. She was just heartbroken and felt abandoned. Oakstar shouldn't have cast her out of ThunderClan and Appledusk should never have cheated on her. Her kits would have stayed alive if those two things had never happened.

[Ragwort]

Originally Posted by Silverdream

I don't think that Mapleshade was evil at all. She was just heartbroken and felt abandoned. Oakstar shouldn't have cast her out of ThunderClan and Appledusk should never have cheated on her. Her kits would have stayed alive if those two things had never happened.

i agree, and i feel that the cats she killed pretty much deserved it after the way they treated her!

[BEAR.]

Hey look it's a big post about Mapleshade.

[Tess_Potter]

Originally Posted by BILL.

Hey look it's a big post about Mapleshade.

Bluefur did quite a few of the same things as Mapleshade do you hate Bluestar too

[Ragwort]

Originally Posted by BILL.

Hey look it's a big post about Mapleshade.

Originally Posted by Silverdream

Bluefur did quite a few of the same things as Mapleshade do you hate Bluestar too

yeah, do you?

[BEAR.]

I recommend reading what I linked. It covers Mapleshade's actions in depth as taken from the story.

Mapleshade is an unreliable narrator incapable of accepting that many of her problems were caused by herself. @Silverdream, @Rogueheart

[WinterMara]

Okay so, I'm just going to throw my opinion out there, this isn't to attack anyone or their opinions, it's just so people can see the other side of things and have a better understanding:

While I don't want to say that she was evil, as I dislike using that term, she certainly wasn't in the right and was an unreliable POV in her book, and I will state my reasonings. No, Oakstar should've not exiled her kits, I agree with that, however, she also made an error in not crossing the twoleg bridge to Riverclan and instead having her kits cross the river via stones during a storm, so it's not like she's a completely helpless victim there.

For Appledusk cheating on her, one, it was moreso for his reputation and safety, and two, cheating doesn't justify murder and him staying by Mapleshade's side wouldn't of prevented anything, besides possibly his own death.

Ravenwing in my opinion didn't deserve to die because he was a newer medicine cat when he was murdered and misinterpreted an omen from Starclan, and he also deemed it his job to let Oakstar and his clan know that Mapleshade broke the code.

Frecklewish is. . .easily the most innocent here, she didn't watch the kits die, she just saw them get to the THC/RC border, and while she did call the kits some terrible things, you need to remember that she was still grieving for her dead brother and felt betrayed by Mapleshade, you wouldn't act normal in her situation.

I can understand feeling sympathy for Mapleshade, but she certainly wasn't an innocent cat in this situation, she murdered three cats who just made a few mistakes and blamed them for her kits deaths, even thought when it came to the final moments, she had a good chunk of the blame.

again, this isn't to attack anyone or their opinions, so please don't see this as such.

| @Rogueheart @Silverdream [I'm mentioning ya'all in an edit as it feels like my response isn't being taken into consideration, if it is, then I apologize!]

[Tess_Potter]

Originally Posted by BILL.

I recommend reading what I linked. It covers Mapleshade's actions in depth as taken from the story.

Mapleshade is an unreliable narrator incapable of accepting that many of her problems were caused by herself. @Silverdream, @Rogueheart

That is true but Bluestar also caused most of her own problems. She shouldn't have met up with Oakheart in the first place. She's responsible for the deaths of Snowfur and Mosskit. I think she was a great leader but I also think she should have kept her kits. Deputies can have kits. I mean Squirrelflight was deputy when she gave birth to Alderkit and Sparkkit.

[elaif]

hmmm, i have mixed feelings on Maple'shade. In the beginning Maple'shade is at the wrong, she falls in love with a cat she wasnt supposed to (I don't see anything wrong there tho-). It wouldn't of been that bad if she had told the truth about the kits, but NO she lied to both Oak'star and Freckle'wish saying that her kits father was THEIR dead brother/son. Oak'star and Freckle'wish were ofc relieved at the thought that their lost kin isnt completely gone, and that he would live on thru these unborn lives. Long story short they find out that she not only lied about Birch'face being the father, but the true father had practically killed both Birch and his apprentice. Probably blinded by rage and some grief, he removed the lying she out of the clan not really thinking of the consequences of crossing of the river. Now for Apple'dusk he was rather pathetic and honestly deserved it. Anyhow, moral of the story... yea we should feel some sympathy for Maple'shade, but put yourself in both Oak'star and Freckle'wishs shoes....

( edit it looks like some ppl already had my opinion posted here lol)

[BEAR.]

This isn't about Bluestar. We're discussing Mapleshade.
If you want to compare apples to oranges, Bluestar had kits with Oakheart at a time when tensions weren't escalated by two cats recently being killed* (In Mapleshade's book, Birchface and Flowerpaw were huge losses to TC and ThunderClan was furious with RC.) Snowfur's death was the result of Snowfur driving off ShadowClan cats - she followed them onto the Thunderpath and got hit. The discussion with Bluefur prior did not impact her choice.
Her decision to move her kits during Leaf-bare was poor but was caused by pressure from Sunstar. "It's a shame you had kits, I know this hasn't been mentioned before but here in ThunderClan deputies can't be in the nursery with children. I guess instead of having you utilize the other queens or be helped by another warrior if I appointed you, I'll go with Mr. McMurderface in the corner." Yikes! (Bonus: Squirrelflight had kits as a deputy, and Leafstar had kits as a leader - you don't see them having their positions threatened over that.)
Bluestar also didn't murder three cats out of a desire for revenge and attempt to kill a queen.
@Silverdream

I linked a post regarding Mapleshade's Vengeance in my original message. I think you should read it.